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Subject: "Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..." Archived thread - Read only
 
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Bruceadmin

08-04-02, 09:18 AM (GMT)
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"Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
 
  
In todays links we came across a piece from the Independant:

The Top Brass: Perfect poise and the Nutcrackers who made critics' eyes water
The 10 leading ballet dancers in Britain, as chosen by their peers
Compiled by Kate Hilpern
Dancing Times seems to have advised in some way on the list
The list is:
Alina Cojocaru
Chi Cao
Iain Mackay
Robert Parker
Ivan Putrov
Yosvani Ramos
Tamara Rojo
Nao Sakuma
Erina Takahashi
Edward Watson
http://www.independent.co.uk/story.jsp?story=282264

Is this list the right one? Comments and thoughts please... but can we please remember to be respectful as we discuss!


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Jonathan S 08-04-02 1
     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Tim Powell 08-04-02 2
  RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... sylvia 08-04-02 3
     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Steven 08-04-02 4
         RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 5
             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 6
                 RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Robert 09-04-02 7
                     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 8
                 RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Terry Amos 09-04-02 9
                     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 10
                     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 11
                         RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 12
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 13
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 09-04-02 14
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Robert 10-04-02 15
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Viviane 10-04-02 17
         RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... alison 10-04-02 16
             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... emma 10-04-02 18
                 RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 10-04-02 19
                     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Terry Amos 10-04-02 20
                         RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 10-04-02 21
                     RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... AEHandley 10-04-02 22
                         RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Robert 11-04-02 23
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 11-04-02 24
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Paul A 11-04-02 25
                             RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain... Flight 11-04-02 26

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Jonathan S

08-04-02, 09:29 AM (GMT)
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1. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #0
 
   LAST EDITED ON 08-04-02 AT 09:34 AM (GMT)

It's a funny old world. The Independent's slogan used to be "It is. Are you?", now it syndicated stories rehashed from the Dancing Times. Call me old-fashioned, but I'd want a broadsheet that calls itself independent to evaluate a list like this and come up with some ideas of its own.


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Tim Powell

08-04-02, 11:08 AM (GMT)
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2. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #1
 
   This article appeared rather oddly in the Business Section of the IOS and it was not clear who the peers were, who selected the list or what were their criteria. I understood the footnote to mean that The Dancing Times had supplied resumes of the dancers not that they had compiled the original list. There it was oddly placed and insufficiently explained.
Given no criteria it is hard to comment on the list, they seem to have go to the three companies and picked a few from each and it is hard to quarrel with any of the selections but I would have thought that Nunez for one is a glaring omission.


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sylvia

08-04-02, 11:14 AM (GMT)
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3. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #0
 
   It's a bit curious this list. It says it was chosen by peers which I assume to mean fellow dancers so why bring the critics into it in the subheading. And which dancers, which companies - just the RB, ENB and BRB? Do the dancers get to vote for dancers in other companies or just their own? If it's the former how fair can it be - I doubt the RB dancers get much of a chance to see dancers in BRB. And if it's the latter how many dancers were each company allowed to vote for - were the votes adjusted depending on the size of each company? What criteria did they use if any? Little details I'd love to know.

On the list itself I have to confess I've seen the BRB and ENB dancers listed only briefly so I can't really comment. I wonder if dancers' perceptions on who the best are differ quite a bit from that of the audience. I guess my only surprise is that Johan Kobborg isn't on there - right now I really do think he's THE best in Britain.


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Steven

08-04-02, 11:49 AM (GMT)
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4. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #3
 
   It's actually a list of the ten best YOUNGER dancers, isn't it? I'm not a big Kobborg fan myself but I quite recognise his right to be included in a definitive ten best. He has achieved a lot in his career. Similarly Sylvie Guillem. These ten could all be said to have their best years ahead of them, even though many are already principals in their companies and dancing leading roles. And what does "in Britain" mean? "In Britain at this very moment"? With so many excellent freelance dancers making regular appearances here, it is strange to find that all are regular members of British companies.

Not that this worries me. I find lists of the "ten best" anything rather ridiculous anyway. Why should there be ten best of anything? Why not twelve? Why not two? Or just one?

We're all perfectly entitled to make our own lists or none at all.


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Flight

09-04-02, 10:45 AM (GMT)
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5. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #4
 
  
>I find lists of the
>"ten best" anything rather ridiculous
>anyway. Why should there
>be ten best of anything?
> Why not twelve?
>Why not two? Or
>just one?
>
>We're all perfectly entitled to make
>our own lists or none
>at all.

Exactly. And does it mean the best techniwue, the best artistry, the best musicality?


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Flight

09-04-02, 01:18 PM (GMT)
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6. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #5
 
   And I certainly wouldn't agree anout Iain MacKay


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Robert

09-04-02, 03:28 PM (GMT)
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7. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #6
 
   It should have been titled 'my favourite dancers'. Perhaps we should all compose a list, followed by 'my least favourite dancers.


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Flight

09-04-02, 03:39 PM (GMT)
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8. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #7
 
   Quite so. I feel very uncomfortable with the idea of there being a best of anything.


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Terry Amos

09-04-02, 05:16 PM (GMT)
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9. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #6
 
   If you are judging him by his performance as Romeo in Sunderland, you should give him another chance. He doesn't usually dance like that.


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Flight

09-04-02, 09:16 PM (GMT)
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10. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #9
 
   I didn't see that - I only saw the one cast. But when I have seen him before, he strikes me as having stiff port de bras and an unelastic jump.


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Flight

09-04-02, 09:18 PM (GMT)
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11. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #9
 
   And a rather annoying expression on his face. Nevertheless I have nothing against him as such, I just wouldn't choose him as one of my 'top ten'.


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Flight

09-04-02, 09:43 PM (GMT)
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12. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #11
 
   LAST EDITED ON 09-04-02 AT 09:44 PM (GMT)

I agree about Alina Cojocaru though - I imagine most people do.
And probabluy Chi Chao - I have been waiting for years for him to be promoted. Quite possibly Robert Parker, too. I haven't seen much of Putrov - just the act 1 Giselle pas de six, and when he was the Nutcracker on the television. I'm afraid I've never seen Ramos or Takashiki - ENB never come anywhere near here. But definitely Tamara Rojo. Possibly Nao Sakuma, but I can think of other female dancers to replace her if this wasn't a 'young dancers' thing. Only seen Watson in pas de six, etc. in the classics - none of the modern work he's so good at. So can't really comment.

If older dancers were featured, I'd say Sergiu Pobereznic, Monica Zamora, Bussell, Yoshida, Guillem (some obvious ones here)and Cope. I'm afraid Kobborg isn't one of my favourites. Corella is though!

So my favourite dancers would be: Cojocaru, Rojo, Chao, Parker, Pobereznic, Sakuma, Zamora, Bussell, Yoshida, Corella, Guillem and Cope. There! That is twelve! Rebellion!

Wouldn't it be marvellous if we could do favourites from all ballet history? And then favourites from all over the world?


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Flight

09-04-02, 09:47 PM (GMT)
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13. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #12
 
   LAST EDITED ON 09-04-02 AT 09:52 PM (GMT)

Sorry, I get a bit over-excited sometimes. I am sort of bouncing around on my chair thinking of Ferri and Baryshnikov Fonteyn and Penney and Alsymuratova and RUZIMATOV!!!


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Flight

09-04-02, 09:54 PM (GMT)
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14. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #13
 
   And Durante.

I will stop flooding this thread now.


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Robert

10-04-02, 12:50 PM (GMT)
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15. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #14
 
   Flight, someone else suggested you got on with your revision. I do not want to say anything ..... but......
Good luck
Robert


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Viviane

10-04-02, 01:12 PM (GMT)
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17. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #15
 
   Flight, I hope we'll hear you after your revisions too


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alison

10-04-02, 01:06 PM (GMT)
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16. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #4
 
   >It's actually a list of the
>ten best YOUNGER dancers, isn't
>it?

That would explain the glaring omissions. I was going to ask why Edur and Oaks weren't included. Wonder what the cutoff age is that Kobborg's not included?

>Not that this worries me.
>I find lists of the
>"ten best" anything rather ridiculous
>anyway.

Yes, it's all so subjective, isn't it?


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emma

10-04-02, 02:42 PM (GMT)
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18. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #16
 
   I think Accosta is the most exciting dancer I've seen, he makes my list, although I've not seen enough to judge.


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Flight

10-04-02, 03:04 PM (GMT)
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19. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #18
 
   It's OK, when I fail I will just blame Mr Marriot.

I would love to see Acosta! No plans to in the near future though


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Terry Amos

10-04-02, 04:33 PM (GMT)
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20. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #19
 
   But isn't the whole point that the original ten were chosen by dancers?

I think such a selection is interesting, although it would be nice to know how it was done, e.g. who were invited to vote and were they restricted to selecting younger dancers only.


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Flight

10-04-02, 06:20 PM (GMT)
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21. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #20
 
   I think what would have happened, though, is that the Royal were asked to choose however many dancers, BRB however many, and ENB however many, so it would not be as if the Royal chose people from BRB and ENB too. Just from their own company.


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AEHandley

10-04-02, 07:09 PM (GMT)
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22. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #19
 
   I've only seen him 3 times (once on TV in Coppelia with Benjamin, once with Durante in Rhapsody and once with Wildor in the Dream) He didn't really do much for me in Rhapsody - danced well but not IMO a good match with Durante, and his Franz was merely OK to me - nothing wrong with it but not anything special. But as Oberon he was THRILLING. Very powerful presence, and very "other worldly". Try and see him if you can - a great technique and the possibility to be a very interesting dancer.


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Robert

11-04-02, 04:50 PM (GMT)
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23. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #22
 
   To AE Handley.
Sorry to be picky but 'who' have you only seen three times?

Get on with your revision Flight, and don't try to blame poor old Bruce! I bet he passed his exams.


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Flight

11-04-02, 05:06 PM (GMT)
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24. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #23
 
   Mock me not! I passed all mine last year - got A's in all of 'em. But now I am in the fourth year so they are all past GCSE papers.

I think she was talking about Carlos Acosta.


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Paul A

11-04-02, 05:21 PM (GMT)
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25. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #24
 
   Does anybody know how Dancing times compiled this list?

If it's their informed view of up&comings/ nearly theres then it is an interesting choice - though with some gaps.


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Flight

11-04-02, 05:28 PM (GMT)
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26. "RE: Ten leading ballet dancers in Britain..."
In response to message #25
 
   I think DT just suppllied the info about the dancers.


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