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Subject: "Why guests, when we have some splended boys" Archived thread - Read only
 
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Conferences What's Happening Topic #2314
Reading Topic #2314
Jason

30-11-01, 00:31 AM (GMT)
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"Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
 
   I was surprised this evening to see Stiefel dance when we have boys who are certainly good enough, if not
better to dance Lensky, so why pay huge amounts for guest artists?
Copper fine as he really is R.B, and why did Sara not get Onegin, with Adam they would have brought the house down, the audience were thrilled to see Adam back were he belongs
Another question,why give Cojocaru two leading roles in the same ballet, its very unfair to the first soloists, who seem to have very little to do not very inspiring for them.
To date the worst cast has been Cojocaru and Kobborg, she is not a Tatiana, and Kobborg seems not to have an spark of emotion in him, this was noticable in Don Q, as Onegin he he is like a wet fish, he was very nice when he joined the company, but has gone downhill at a rapid speed, is he homesick may one ask? I shall not bother to use my ticket Saturday, so if any one would like it , please let me know.
Tewsley was wonderful, but again a R.B product, anther dancer who the R.B let slip through their fingers.
and why did Jonathan Cope not get an Onegin, as good as Tewsley is Johnathan should have been given the role, does Stretton not like the R.B men, I see a lot of the male promotions at the end of last season are back dancing in the corps, along with the female soloists, comletly mad.
Madam if she is watching from above must be horrified.as many of us regulars are.


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  Subject     Author     Message Date     ID  
  RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys cecelia 30-11-01 1
  RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Bruce Madmin 30-11-01 2
     RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Terry Amos 30-11-01 3
         RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Brendan McCarthymoderator 30-11-01 5
             RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys lara 30-11-01 7
                 RE: Why guests, when we have some splendid boys Brendan McC 30-11-01 8
                     RE: Why guests, when we have some splendid boys Anneliese Handley 30-11-01 12
  RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys alison 30-11-01 6
     RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Robert 30-11-01 9
         RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Brendan 30-11-01 10
             RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys tortie14 30-11-01 11
                 RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Terry Amos 01-12-01 13
                     RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys Michael 01-12-01 14
                         RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys gary 02-12-01 15

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cecelia

30-11-01, 02:02 AM (GMT)
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1. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #0
 
   Hi Jason

I was intrigued by the very positive review Cojocaru and Kobborg got today and would very much like to see them for myself on Saturday if you haven't already given away your ticket.

Cheers!

email: cece_knight@yahoo.co.uk or phone 0870 357 1962


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Bruce Madmin

30-11-01, 08:26 AM (GMT)
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2. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #0
 
   I'm sure over time we will see more RB dancers brought through in many different ballets - that's the way you grow a company you lead. But of course Stretton is still learning about the dancers and in any event Onegin casting was not solely his call. There were many posts on this earlier I think.

If you want Onegin you take the package (same with any ballet of course) and those who own it seem to take a pretty clear line on who dances it. In taking Onegin this is not a particularly attractive part of the package I think, but you have to look at the overall position and the general view is that Onegin was a terrific acquisition for RB and its public. With a successful first run looking assured, like others, I very much hope to see a variety of dancers tested in its roles over the coming years.


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Terry Amos

30-11-01, 12:05 PM (GMT)
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3. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #2
 
   If a company wants a ballet from an outside choreographer or one controlled by some sort of trust, then you have to allow them a big say in the casting. But that should be casting from inside the company. To allow them to bring in loads of dancers as guest artists is no way to improve a company. If your own dancers are perceived as being unsuited for the roles, get some other ballet which does suit them.


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Brendan McCarthymoderator

30-11-01, 12:25 PM (GMT)
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5. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #3
 
   So is Terry implying that the Royal Ballet should not have done Onegin? I saw it last night and it is very fine. It graces the Royal Ballet and it is a convincing riposte to those who were quick to question Ross Stretton's directorship on the slender evidence of one earlier production.

While I don't dismiss Terry's wider point, Onegin is a special case. The production amply justified the compromises which were made to bring it into the repertory.

On the issue of Jason's contribution, I really think he should have identified himself properly. There may be good reasons for occasional anonymity in postings; it is hard to see that it was justified in this case


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lara

30-11-01, 04:01 PM (GMT)
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7. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #5
 
   On the issue of Jason's contribution,
>I really think he should
>have identified himself properly. There
>may be good reasons for
>occasional anonymity in postings; it
>is hard to see that
>it was justified in this
>case

I am wondering why you think he did not identify himself properly. Many others on this board post using only their first names and with no email address listed. Right now I can't remember if MY email address is listed and I use only my first name.

Jason's post brought up some interesting points and in a non-acrimonious way. Let's be nice to the new people who post and not scare them away!


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Brendan McC

30-11-01, 05:21 PM (GMT)
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8. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splendid boys"
In response to message #7
 
   Jason is by no means a new poster. In the past he has been highly critical of individual members of the Royal Ballet, and sometimes hurtfully so. I feel that if people are prepared to use ballet.co to make very contentious statements, they should be prepared to stand behind them. They should also justify these statements with rational argument.

As to our use of first names, many of us know the identities of Vivienne, Bruce, Jonathan, Lara, Shirley, Anneliese, Pete, to mention just a few. They use their first names, but not with any intention to mask their identities. Jason's case is a bit different. Anonymity is understandable if you're a bit shy, or if you are a member of a company who is not free to speak openly. But even then any interest should be made clear.

Because Jason seems to have a particular agenda and has 'form' for posting in an excitable way (to say the least), I thought it right to make the point.


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Anneliese Handley

30-11-01, 10:59 PM (GMT)
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12. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splendid boys"
In response to message #8
 
   In self defence - every so often I post my full name and email address, but as a fairly regular poster here with an unusual and long name (a) there's little chance of confusion with any of the other 150 Annelieses and (b) it saves me a few key strokes. It isn't my intention to hide behind an alias! And Bruce and Brendan and Ann Williams and Paul and Helen have all met me so they know I'm real...


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alison

30-11-01, 01:34 PM (GMT)
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6. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #0
 
  
>Another question,why give Cojocaru two leading
>roles in the same ballet,
>its very unfair to the
>first soloists, who seem to
>have very little to do
>
>not very inspiring for them.

Why pick on Cojocaru? Tapper's doing both roles too, and Coppen's dancing both men (now, that was a real surprise to me!).

>Kobborg seems not to have
>an spark of emotion in
>him.

Pardon? Where were you sitting? If you'd been much further away than I was, you wouldn't have been in the building at all! I admit I do sometimes think that Kobborg hasn't totally got used to the size of the ROH, but to say that he's got no emotion at all, when he's rapidly turning into the RB's best male dramatic dancer, is just unbelievable.

>and why did Jonathan Cope not
>get an Onegin, as good
>as Tewsley is Johnathan should
>have been given the role,
>does Stretton not like the
>R.B men

In that interview earlier in the week (see the Reviews posting), Stretton was quoted as saying how much he likes Cope. Do bear in mind that it probably wasn't STretton's choice anyway.


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Robert

30-11-01, 05:51 PM (GMT)
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9. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #6
 
   Brendan
Perhaps Jason fears getting an infected email from you, I got two yesterday. I agree with Lara he should be welcomed.


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Brendan

30-11-01, 05:56 PM (GMT)
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10. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #9
 
   Robert - I apologise profusely about the infected email. But do see my reply to Lara earlier in the thread at http://www.danze.co.uk/dcforum/happening/2314.html#8


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tortie14

30-11-01, 10:24 PM (GMT)
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11. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #10
 
   Brenda - I am relatively new to Ballet.co postings and use my chat name because I am happier with that - having heard all sorts of warnings about not letting people have personal details on the net I am wary but want to join in. I don't know who any of you are but don't think that it really matters. Jason's posting seemed to be passionate but not abusive or offensive. After all, ballet regulars like nothing better than a jolly good discussion in the interval and we do differ and feel strongly about it - which is fine as long as we listen to one another and agree to differ. I can only talk about this post from Jason - not seen any others.

Personally I love Steifel - bear in mind negotiations with guest stars will involve agents - it may be that he wanted a decent chunk of time with Royal and Onegin was part of the time. Pleeeeeze don't persuade RS to ditch him. I think he and Cojacaru are really good together from what I saw of the first night. I don't think they have a whole lot of young men of their own yet - hopefully they will come through and RS will draw out and develop the talent he has got in the company. I am sure his hands were very tied on Onegin because the casting is extremely odd.

I think there is a place for guests that are excellent - it is good for companies.

I'm minded to give RS the benefit at the moment and not judge too quickly - it is early days.


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Terry Amos

01-12-01, 09:02 PM (GMT)
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13. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #11
 
   To go back to the original point of this thread and to answer Brendan's point. If it is the case that the RB could only get permission to do Onegin by agreeing that in most performances the two main male roles would be danced by guest artists, then, in my view, the company should have refused to do the ballet.

Someone wrote about compromise. I'd have thought it was up to the people who control Onegin to do some compromising. Surely RB's male dancers are not that bad.


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Michael

01-12-01, 10:49 PM (GMT)
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14. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #13
 
   It is a shame that Cope is not dancing Onegin, as he has the stength and presence (and partnering skills) for it. Urlezaga would I think be a very good and ardent Lensky. Watson, when back, would be a fine Lensky. Maybe also Howells. I don't think any of the other company principals and senior soloists would have the necessary partenring skills for Onegin I am also sorry that we didn't see Benjamin as Tatiana and Wildor as Olga. But you never know what will come in the Summer.


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gary

02-12-01, 03:07 AM (GMT)
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15. "RE: Why guests, when we have some splended boys"
In response to message #14
 
   It is sad to say but this country does not promote there own talents, it is a fashion to take from outside as the audience then beleive they are getting the best choice from the world...


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